Fluorocarbon vs. Fluorocarbon Leaders

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Are Fluor0carbon Leaders the same material you get on a spool of Fluorocarbon?  On sites that sell these products, the descriptions for both are the basically identical.  I can buy a 200 or 300 yd spool for a lot less than a spool of 30-50 yd leader spool and make my own!  What are your thoughts and experience?

[WRENCHED 4 IT]

If I’m not mistaken fluorocarbon line is different then fluorocarbon leader. Regular fluorocarbon line is thinner at same weight and softer more pliable. Fluorocarbon leader is thicker and is more resistant to fraying, also just a little stiffer, but has the same characteristics as the regular fluorocarbon. I’ve been using 15lbs and 20lbs fluorocarbon leader for the last couple years and it’s worked very well. 

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Thank you for the response.  I'm going to find out first-hand, since I ordered a wrist-spool of fluoro-leader and another spool of just fluorocarbon fishline last night.  While on this subject though, how long is your typical leader in your set-up?  It's been a minute, or 15, since I was the one making lure & line set-up choices.  So many things have changed, especially with line (braid, lead braid, copper braid, fluoro, mono, etc).  Out of 16 rods/reels spooled, 3 have mono, 4 lead-core braid, 4 with copper braid, and 5 with just braid.  What has been your experience with the various lines?

[WRENCHED 4 IT]

I use 30 ft of fluorocarbon on mono and braid and lead core 15 lbs line till I start to run into more of the green water and the lake starts to get cloudy. Then I switch to the 20lbs on all the above mentioned. On all the copper long lines I run the 20lbs all year long and usually I use a little longer lead to get more shock absorption, I’ll run out 45-60 ft . Paul that’s a good starting point. Don’t be afraid to experiment with longer or shorter leads depending on depth of water and clarity. I let others chime in with what they use. Good fishing.

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Dave,

Thank you for the info.  Finding out Leader Length is quite the conundrum to decipher.  In YouTube videos, everyone has a different opinion on leader length.  A lot depends on how you have your line deployed, whether it be dipsy divers, jet divers, down-rigger, then add spin doctors or flashers, and let's not forget shallow diver flat lines. 

I've seen or read about lengths from 4 foot to as much as 50 feet. Most seem to settle on 3 to 4 wingspan lengths (approximatlet 18 - 24 ft), as you measure out the leader and some line loss from tying the FG Knot.

I'm going to be working on leaders this weekend, so I am going to make several, but in different lengths and see what works best for my situation.  20-30 foot sounds like a sweet spot, so will make several.  Thanks again for the recommendation.

 

Paul

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Dave,

Why do you use fluorocarbon leader on mono lines?  Why not just run mono?  I have 4 reels loaded with mono and were planning on using them for my surface lines for Coho.  Back in the late 70's early 80's, before the rise of Braid, wire, lead and copper, our reels were loaded with mono.  And we put our share of fish in the box, losing a few but none because the line broke.

Into the 90's and beyond, my Salmon fishing was limited to Charter's for lack of a boat, or friends with a boat that actually want to go out and fish!.  So, I never really kept up with all the changes in line; so I am ignorant on that subject.  Right now, I have so many irons in the fire, it's not a wabbit hole I want to get into. This is going to be a year of learning and relearning, which was expected.  Just itching to get that first fish of 2024 in the box, and any advice or helpful hints along the way are much appreciated.

Paul

 

[WRENCHED 4 IT]

Paul,

I know a lot of guys who use straight 15lbs - 20lbs mono and a few that run straight 30lbs mono all year long. Hears my thoughts. The lake, do to zebra muscles, has cleared up to a point where the fish can see the line. To me in 15 to 45 ft depths the water is so clear that I want every advantage possible, I’ll even run out farther leaders sometimes out maybe 100 plus feet depending on the bite. Thus I went to the fluorocarbon line. I found early morning before sunrise I could run mono with no problem in shallow. Once the sun came up  my fluorocarbon rods would out produce the mono. Maybe it’s just on my boat but this is what I’ve found. Once I start fishing deeper water I  don’t see as much of difference in line size or mono versus fluorocarbon, which kind of proved my point. So I switch to 20lbs fluorocarbon, reason being I might start my day in closer but head out to deeper water. This way I’m covered for both. Hope this helped.

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Dave,

Thank you for sharing your experience regarding line.  I've known about zebra mussels for over 25 yrs, and being in the shellfish family, it makes sense they clean the water (like clams, oysters, etc). What I didn't do in my mind was the connect those thoughts. Namely, they clean the water, line is now more visible.  Duh! 

As I previously mentioned, I have little knowledge regarding line choices.  What has been your experience with Braid?  Braid with Lead Core? Copper Braid?  I am experimenting with all 3 to see what works. 

I did receive my spools of fluorocarbon and fluorocarbon leader over the weekend.  And unless there is some sort of gauge to discern the difference, I cannot see or feel it.  Both are Clear, 30 lb., appear identical when put to a blind test, share the same diameter at 0.020", and both have the same stiffness/suppleness.  The Fluoro line is a 200 yd spool of Suffix Advance; and the 100 yd spool of Fluoro Leader is Seaguar Blue Label DSF.  Since I cannot discern any difference, I think I now have 300 yds of Fluoro I can use as leaders.  lol

Again, thank you for relating your knowledge and experience.  Typically, fisherman don't like to share too much info, play it close to the vest and trust no one! However, with the plethora of Perch, Salmon and Trout in the Lake, there is more than plenty for all. 

A few last questions, if you will...  Tell me all about your boat. (I know, I'm opening a can of worms!)  Do you trailer or have a slip? Which is your Home Port, and have you been out Salmon fishing yet?  I am still a week to 10 days away from being ready.  Boat is coming back from OB Mechanic on Wednesday or Thursday, and I have installs to complete before launching.  

Nice communicating with you.  It is always good to make new friends with common interests! 

Paul

[WRENCHED 4 IT]

Paul,

I used straight braid on my regular dipsy rods and a braid backer about 100ft on copper dipsy rods. I use a fluorocarbon leader from dipsy out to lure of 20 ft with a rubber snubber on front of dipsy . Lead core I run the same 100 ft braid tied to the lead core and a 45 ft leader of fluorocarbon tied to the end to lure. On my copper long lines I do the same as the lead core.

My boat is a 21 ft deep v center console Robalo with 200 hp Yamaha 4 stroke. I run a maximum of 12 rods. I trailer this combo giving me the advantage of traveling port to port as the fish move up the coast from St. Joe in the spring  to Ludington in the fall. I’ll be getting the boat out middle of March and will hopefully get out soon after.

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Wow!  Mind Blown on the subject of line.  Great info; just took a while to digest and absorb. Completely new to braid, lead core and copper. No experience, so trying a little of everything spreading it across 16 reels.  Planning on making and attaching leaders and setting up the terminal tackle over the weekend.  Will apply the info you provided, as it is a great starting point that gives me a leg up on the learning curve.

I can easily run 10 lines with 3 off each Planer Board, 2 on downriggers and a stacker on each dr.  I also have a 5-stand rocket launcher on the roof, which is basically a 5-stand rod holder.   

It's been a minute since I piloted a boat while trolling lines, so I'm not going into this being too ambitious.  As it is, I'll be lucky if I can find someone to go out with me half the time. My wife really isn't into fishing, but her licensed presence onboard allows me 3 more lines in the water and 5 more fish.  However, she works during the week, and I am retired.  Trying to avoid the Weekend Warriors.

Another Wow!  We both have boats with similarities.  Both 21', Deep V, OB propelled, and trailering.  Very Sweet!  Yours is center console, though.  Do you have an Isinglass/canvas enclosure for your helm, for the colder days on the Lake?  Do you ever fish further South in Indiana waters?  I'm planning on buying a Michigan license for later in the season when the fish move deeper.  And I want to keep the wife happy, so we were looking at taking some fun trips up the coast of Michigan to New Buffalo, Saugatuck, and Holland.  And at some point, I just know I'm going to want to put a line in the water.  Michigan is a great outdoor State!     

I'm still waiting on getting mine back from the Honda Marine repair shop.  My engine has 2400 hrs on it, so I bit the bullet and had them give me a full assessment, along with all the preseason maintenance.  The news was very good.  The previous owner took excellent care of the motor, and it should last another 2400 to 3600 hours, if maintained properly.  I should be getting her back this week or early next.  Then I have installs to perform.  Maybe in the water by March 7.

If you ever feel like heading to Indiana, you are more than welcome to join me.  At some point in the season when the fish move further North, maybe I could join you. Beats the hell out of trailering a boat that far!  Don't know about you, but I only get 10-11 mpg when pulling my boat.  It's a beast weight-wise at 4800# without the engine, and all the other add-ons and gear. 

Sending some pics of the Planer Boards and motor unit I will eventually being running.  Take care.  Let's keep in touch!  I've learned quite a bit from our discussions.  Thank you.

Paul

 

 

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Sorry, forgot to attach the pics.

[WRENCHED 4 IT]

Good talking to you too Paul. No enclosure on my boat, at times I wish it did. I’m kicking around the thought of bringing out a portable heater. My previous boat had an enclosure and I do miss having a place to get out of the wind and cold. As far as going fishing together I’d be open too it, Im always looking to learn and the best way is to fish with another captain.

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

I bought a Mr. Heat Propane stand alone for around $100 before Christmas, so my wife got me a heater for the boat...... either that or a Cabela's/Bass Pro Gift Card.  Actually, I used it more than a couple times working on the boat and trailer. It's stored indoors, but not heated indoor storage. 

Absolutely thrilled you are interested in fishing together sometime.  My friends that fish, I'll be lucky to get any of them to go until some really warm days in April.  I'm probably going to trolling solo most of the time, and occasionally with my wife.  She's not a fan of the cold, and legally can't fish until April 1, when her 2024 license is valid.  She never fished before. But she has watched me fish when we have went camping.  Buying a 2023 license would only be worth the price if she fished every day the rest of the month, and that isn't going to happen. So, there is always have room for a fishing buddy.  I'll let you know when I get the 2024 shakedown cruise behind me and see where that leads (what else needs replacement or fixing?).  After that, anytime you feel the urge, let me know and we'll make it happen.  My phone is 219-306-1225.

The picture of the planer motors I posted has changed slightly.  I reconfigured the motors on the bracket so a quick release mount can be attached.  The post was a picture taken immediately after removing it from the box. 

[WRENCHED 4 IT]

Great idea having a portable propane heater. I was a little apprehensive on using one since most of the time I’m fishing in waves. Let me know how that works. 

I wont have the boat out of storage till April 9 and have some new items to install before I do my shake down run. Fishing in early to late April is usually spotty do to water temp. I think where your at I’ve heard that once the ice moves out fishing starts.

ill send you a pic once I hit the water, my phone number is 1-616-401-5069

[Michael11]

On 2/28/2024 at 5:14 PM, Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy said:

Wow!  Mind Blown on the subject of line.  Great info; just took a while to digest and absorb. Completely new to braid, lead core and copper. No experience, so trying a little of everything spreading it across 16 reels.  Planning on making and attaching leaders and setting up the terminal tackle over the weekend.  Will apply the info you provided, as it is a great starting point that gives me a leg up on the learning curve.

I can easily run 10 lines with 3 off each Planer Board, 2 on downriggers and a stacker on each dr.  I also have a 5-stand rocket launcher on the roof, which is basically a 5-stand rod holder.   

It's been a minute since I piloted a boat while trolling lines, so I'm not going into this being too ambitious.  As it is, I'll be lucky if I can find someone to go out with me half the time. My wife really isn't into fishing, but her licensed presence onboard allows me 3 more lines in the water and 5 more fish.  However, she works during the week, and I am retired.  Trying to avoid the Weekend Warriors.

Another Wow!  We both have boats with similarities.  Both 21', Deep V, OB propelled, and trailering.  Very Sweet!  Yours is center console, though.  Do you have an Isinglass/canvas enclosure for your helm, for the colder days on the Lake?  Do you ever fish further South in Indiana waters?  I'm planning on buying a Michigan license for later in the season when the fish move deeper.  And I want to keep the wife happy, so we were looking at taking some fun trips up the coast of Michigan to New Buffalo, Saugatuck, and Holland.  And at some point, I just know I'm going to want to put a line in the water.  Michigan is a great outdoor State!     

I'm still waiting on getting mine back from the Honda Marine repair shop.  My engine has 2400 hrs on it, so I bit the bullet and had them give me a full assessment, along with all the preseason maintenance.  The news was very good.  The previous owner took excellent care of the motor, and it should last another 2400 to 3600 hours, if maintained properly.  I should be getting her back this week or early next.  Then I have installs to perform.  Maybe in the water by March 7.

If you ever feel like heading to Indiana, you are more than welcome to join me.  At some point in the season when the fish move further North, maybe I could join you. Beats the hell out of trailering a boat that far!  Don't know about you, but I only get 10-11 mpg when pulling my boat.  It's a beast weight-wise at 4800# without the engine, and all the other add-ons and gear. 

Sending some pics of the Planer Boards and motor unit I will eventually being running.  Take care.  Let's keep in touch!  I've learned quite a bit from our discussions.  Thank you.

Paul

 

 

Paul, that sounds like an incredible setup you’ve got planned! It reminds me of a recent experience with a marine survey service. I had a boat that needed some repairs, and before diving in, I decided to get a full assessment done. The team at kikimarinesurveyor.ca went over everything in detail, checking the structural integrity, engine condition, and even smaller things I hadn’t thought to look at.

Turns out, there were a few hidden issues that could have caused problems down the line, so having that inspection saved me from unexpected headaches. It was a great experience overall, and I felt much more confident moving forward with the repairs. Now, I’m just counting down the days until I can get back on the water! Hope you get your boat back soon—sounds like you’ve got some great trips ahead.

[Paul Pogo - Reel Therapy]

Michael,

Thanks for your response.  Since my original post was about a year ago, the modifications/upgrades are no longer planned, they're installed!   Also installed a game-changer, at least for me, a RayMarine AutoPilot.

A lot of work last year, so we did not get out as much as desired.  Nearly 2 months of boating opportunity were lost account of a faulty AutoPilot hydraulic pump.  Quite the challenge losing 80% steering control to Starboard, 2 miles out on the Lake, when the intent was to commission, calibrate and fish with the AP.  Fortunately, we managed to limp back into port without a tow.   30 days of those 2 months were spend waiting on the Warranty process to replace the unit.  We did finally get out to commission/calibrate the AP on Oct 27th. 

90% of the time, it's me plus 1 onboard, a problem when there is a fish on!  One person needs to pilot the boat or risk lines, especially tangling planer board lines.  The other person needs to play, bring the fish to the boat, & net it, too!  A disadvantage to not having a 3rd.  The AP eliminates that dependance for need a 3rd person, freeing up the man at the helm.

What rig do you run/fish on the Lake (boat type, size, power)? What's your fishing set-up look like? And out of which port do you hail?  We are new to owning and looking to make new boating/fishing friends.  2025 will be our second season as boat owners.  Although I've been fishing and boating on the Lake since 1979, owning our own boat is completely new and rewarding experience, although it is frustrating at times!

I run a 2007 21' Steiger Craft Miami DV, with a 225 hp Honda OB, out of Portage Marina in Burns Harbor, Indiana.  I trailer to the Portage Marina launch ramp, but store indoors at Doyne's Marina a quarter mile away.  2024 was the first time my boat was in Freshwater.  I bought her in East Maryland from a guy who fished the Chesapeake Bay and hauled her back 750 miles to NW Indiana.  

This year, I am adding a Fish Hawk system, replacing the seawater washdown pump, installing a shore power inlet along with dual battery chargers, and a sensor for automating my aft bilge pump. The challenge I've given myself is taking a stab at making my own Canvas/Isinglass cabin enclosure.  Mine is 18 yrs old and seen better days.  I have a heavy-duty sewing machine, and all the materials have arrived, except the thread. For just under $200, I will have 2 sets of new canvas (one solid canvas, one with Isinglass windows).  Since I've sewn before, this isn't new to me.

Also upgraded my trailer hitch on the truck and the trailer jack. My boat weighs in at 5,400 lbs empty, with the OB motor mounted.  My previous hitch was only rated to 5,000 lbs.  I figure with a half tank of gas (60 gal), the installed equipment, fishing gear, tools, cooler, drinking water and ice, she's tipping the scale somewhere over 7,000 lbs.  This is her only downside, hauling her at 9 miles/gal. Her weight was the only thing I didn't research/consider before purchase!  The addition of shore power is a step toward the future, as we are considering Slipping our boat in 2026. Sometimes, you just don't want to wait a half hour or more in the ramp line. 

Take care, hope to hear back.

Paul