How Deep Does it Go?

[Dave Mull]

So when someone comes out with data that completely goes against what people have thought for years(wether I dispute it or not) you think it's the greatest thing in the world. But when a guys says he hits bottom in 65 ft with a setup many ( including myself) figure as a 75 ft setup it's laughable to you. Interesting

Fishsniffer, I'm truly sorry if I offended you. I honestly didn't mean to or make you think I was laughing at your post--I wasn't. Just trying to be funny and make a joke about zebra mussels coming up and hitting a lure and I should know better. I certainly don't doubt that you hit bottom in the depths you said you did. The data is very surprising to me if it holds to be true as I've had similar experiences of snagging bottom in depths that the data says I shouldn't have. Really, no disrespect at all intended.

[DIRTY DOG]

Absolutely love the fact that all the guys saying using 32lb was useless are now eating crow:lol:

I'm with you Tom , I like the lighter weight copper, for fishing down to 60ft, love the Morgan's 30lb.

[SUPERTRAMP]

im not disputing numbers here...all i know is when my 300 pulls back in 65 ft and i pull it in with zebra mussels i gotta believe it hit bottom...and i wasnt turning or running a plug..

I second that I have had the same thing and that is the reason that the 300 coppers don't come out until I am at 75 FOW, never had them pull up mussels at that depth but under that almost every time. We run from 2.2 to 2.7 at the ball, and slower does definitely get deeper, last summer we pulled lake trout out of 100' on 450 copper and on riggers down 105 in 100 FOW, and we got zebra mussels on both. But u have to hit the sand to get the Lake Trout.

[tgafish]

Must have missed those conversations, with all of the different methods to present lures they are only as successfull or useless as the person applying the presentations. If you run a surface program when the fish are 60 feet down you probaly wont catch many fish maybe crows:thumb:

Yup it was a couple years ago when a lot of people were getting back into 30-32lb copper because Blood Run and others were making the super copper. Hell there were a couple years before that I couldn't find 30lb copper in a store. Guys were saying why not just use shorter sections of 45lb instead of wasting time on 32. The reply was it always seems to catch fish and it's much easier to deal with. Well now we see there is basically a negligable difference between 32 and 45 on depth and still a big difference on ease of use and the options it opens up for smaller reels or more backing.

I'm not saying running 45 lb is not a good idea. It just pissed me off that guys were treating others like idiots for even suggesting the use of 32.

[MarkNY]

Man this is confusing. Ive always thought that 300' of 45lb copper will get to approx. 70' and 10 colors of leadcore will get to approx. 55'. Ive hit bottom in those ranges with those rigs albeit there are many variables. Just rigged up 300' of 60lb copper in hopes that it would get me down into the 80-90' range. Blood runs website 300' of 60lb will get to 109' so i guess ill have to test on my own... Mark

[jimcr]

The biggest problem i find with these numbers that most of us [at least on the west side ] run at between 1.8 -2.2 on the probe . not gps speeds . GPS speeds do not take in consideration of currents. I run 1.9 on my probe which can get anywhere from 1.9 to 3.5 on my gps. But lets say I read this wrong then I run .6 slower then the tests, my lines are running much deeper that these at 2.5

[southtrollsouth]

Man this is confusing. Ive always thought that 300' of 45lb copper will get to approx. 70' and 10 colors of leadcore will get to approx. 55'. Ive hit bottom in those ranges with those rigs albeit there are many variables. Just rigged up 300' of 60lb copper in hopes that it would get me down into the 80-90' range. Blood runs website 300' of 60lb will get to 109' so i guess ill have to test on my own... Mark

Mark, take a look again. 300' of 60lb copper™ with a spoon readings back were at 64'. 500' of 60lb Copper™ was recorded at 109'

[southtrollsouth]

The biggest problem i find with these numbers that most of us [at least on the west side ] run at between 1.8 -2.2 on the probe . not gps speeds . GPS speeds do not take in consideration of currents. I run 1.9 on my probe which can get anywhere from 1.9 to 3.5 on my gps. But lets say I read this wrong then I run .6 slower then the tests, my lines are running much deeper that these at 2.5

You hit the nail on the head Jim! These numbers were taken at 2.5 gps speed with a spoon, no current. They are used as a baseline reference to show representation for that specific speed, conditions and that particular setup only.

Once current, different lures, different downspeeds are introduced, everything will change fairly significantly. Only you will be able to know what your individual depth is for your rigs at any given time when you begin to collect your own data using some kind of depth collecting device or performing your own tests.

Frankly we don't even care what these numbers were after we recorded them. Our reels still say 150, 250, 300 etc. When they get bit, we put more of them out or try to duplicate where we guess it might be...high, low or middle part of the water column....not a particular depth increment.

This whole exercise was to give insight into how much different depth data can be given different situations and lures. If you are surprised with these, wait until you see what 2.0 gps numbers look like.

We are just reporting what we see, everyone else can be the judge. We believe they are extremely accurate, as verified by others using mathematical formulas which match nearly identical (which was very surprising). We had a contest on facebook asking people to guess how deep a 60lb 500' copper would run at 2.5 gps speed. We gave two other pieces of info, weight of 3000' of that material, and depth data from equivalent 45lb.

42 different people calculated approx 109 feet, by using some mathematical formula based on the info we provided. The smart troll reported exactly that...109'. That to us is more than coincidence, to others might just be coincidence.

We did this because we wanted to know, and for the benefit of all fishermen who cannot or do not wish to try and collect data. We report, you can decide. Regardless of anyone's favorite brand of copper or affinity to leadcore.

We will continue to do more and more tests with different setups, different speeds, etc and report them. Hopefully everyone finds enjoyment, usefulness and maybe entertainment in them

You would not believe the amount of both hate mail and "thank you's" we have received because of this. If the hate mail continues, we will probably just keep our numbers to ourselves and not share the information we collect. That will be unfortunate for everyone.

We hope it does not bring out the negative in people who chose to spin this away from its original intent.

[FsnMachine]

It will be interesting when my smart troll unit comes in to play with some depths. We where fishing a strong south east wind a few weeks ago and caught a fish with only 2 of us on board so by the time we netted the fish the wind had turned us and we slowed from 2.5 mph to 1.5mph and a 3 color leadcore snagged zebra muscles off the bottom in 22 feet. I was surprised at how fast it dropped. I will be interested in playing with the smart troll to see how decreased speed affects the drop of wire copper and leadcore. I will not want to be snagging bottom and zebra muscles though with my probes.

[jimcr]

You would not believe the amount of both hate mail and "thank you's" we have received because of this. If the hate mail continues, we will probably just keep our numbers to ourselves and not share the information we collect. That will be unfortunate for everyone.

We hope it does not bring out the negative in people who chose to spin this away from its original intent.

I would like to thank the people that tested and still are testing , its because of people like that that our catch rates go up, with out them we only have data that is meaning less.

I for one really like fishing my copper , I do prefer blood run copper though.

Please post the numbers for 2.0 when they are available, i am sure we will all see the difference and it will open everyone eyes .

Thanks Jim

[1mainiac]

one other thing to consider and that is not every GPS records the same speed I did a test on my boat a couple years ago and ran 2 GPS units My Garmin handheld in a dash mount and My Lowrance 525 they were never even all that close to each other in speed even at trolling speed they were different one would read 2.5 the other would read 2.7. I also found on a trip to NC at Christmas my wife's Tom Tom at highway speeds always read 2mph faster than my el cheapo unit I have on my dash. While I realize you can never believe what Fishsniffer says on the radio during a tournament I have had him pass me when he said he was running the same 2.5 as me.

[Nailer]

Man this is confusing. Ive always thought that 300' of 45lb copper will get to approx. 70' and 10 colors of leadcore will get to approx. 55'. Ive hit bottom in those ranges with those rigs albeit there are many variables. Just rigged up 300' of 60lb copper in hopes that it would get me down into the 80-90' range. Blood runs website 300' of 60lb will get to 109' so i guess ill have to test on my own... Mark

Welcome aboard Mark.