Saginaw Bay Pirates?

[Josey_Wales]

I heard a guy at work talking today about some guys out in Saginaw bay that call themselves the "Saginaw Bay Pirates".

Basically had this elaborate story on how this group of guys has these floatboats and hoverboats that go out on the ice to get the equipment of the ice fisherman who get stranded and picked up by the coast guard? Then either charge them OUTLANDISH amounts of money for their quads or snowmobiles, or just keep them so they dont get fined by the EPA for them going into the water.

Seemed far-fetched to me, but I can understand the EPA fines, and the Coast Guard just saving you and not your equipment.

was this guy crazy or is there some merit to this story?

[Line Dancin]

I heard a guy at work talking today about some guys out in Saginaw bay that call themselves the "Saginaw Bay Pirates".

Basically had this elaborate story on how this group of guys has these floatboats and hoverboats that go out on the ice to get the equipment of the ice fisherman who get stranded and picked up by the coast guard? Then either charge them OUTLANDISH amounts of money for their quads or snowmobiles, or just keep them so they dont get fined by the EPA for them going into the water.

Seemed far-fetched to me, but I can understand the EPA fines, and the Coast Guard just saving you and not your equipment.

was this guy crazy or is there some merit to this story?

they showed something like that on Michigan out of doors last year. Didn't say anything about what they charged but they showed them going out on erie to do rescues and get equipment. The guys that they were with actually used the craft to get out to where the fish were and then when they had break offs they went and did rescues.

[JWheeler]

I am interested in what the legalities of this would be. If they were a licensed recovery company I can see it, but if it's a group of people not a business...hmm

[Josey_Wales]

they showed something like that on Michigan out of doors last year. Didn't say anything about what they charged but they showed them going out on erie to do rescues and get equipment. The guys that they were with actually used the craft to get out to where the fish were and then when they had break offs they went and did rescues.

ya this guy who was a laborer said he was saving his money to buy one of those crafts so he could do it. I question his motives due to the fact that I think he was only in it for the equipment, and not an actual rescue.

[Line Dancin]

the episode on mich outdoors they were fishing and the ice seperated and the group the Mi Outdoors people were walleye fishing got a call from the sherrifs dept to go out on the rescue. They were saying that they and a few other boats do the rescues down there now since there is no coast guard station around monroe any more.

[DIRTY DOG]

the episode on mich outdoors they were fishing and the ice seperated and the group the Mi Outdoors people were walleye fishing got a call from the sherrifs dept to go out on the rescue. They were saying that they and a few other boats do the rescues down there now since there is no coast guard station around monroe any more.

If my memory serves me correctly , this was a guide slash charter comp. , and if so ,I think that if there is anyone in distress they are required to assist in a rescue.

[1mainiac]

I am not a lawyer but anyone taking your property without your consent would be a thief. There is no international waters on the Great Lakes so that portion of Maritime law would not apply. It would be no different than if your car broke down and I came by and towed it home I would have no legal right to it and any attempt to force you to pay would be extortion. Sadly however it would only apply to registered vehicles your fishing gear and personal stuff would be fair game. On the other hand if I was a licensed recovery service and I called and told you I was at your Quad and you could either agree to pay or I would leave it behind that would be legal and I could charge anything I choose and have a legal lien if you failed to pay.

[Josey_Wales]

I am not a lawyer but anyone taking your property without your consent would be a thief. There is no international waters on the Great Lakes so that portion of Maritime law would not apply. It would be no different than if your car broke down and I came by and towed it home I would have no legal right to it and any attempt to force you to pay would be extortion. Sadly however it would only apply to registered vehicles your fishing gear and personal stuff would be fair game. On the other hand if I was a licensed recovery service and I called and told you I was at your Quad and you could either agree to pay or I would leave it behind that would be legal and I could charge anything I choose and have a legal lien if you failed to pay.

This makes perfect sense, however this is what this guy said to me, so I neither support this nor discredit it. If your Quad is out on the ICE and the coast guard comes to "Rescue" you... They rescue you and not your quad. That beeing said you are now leaving your quad behind and have no way to get it. If that quad goes into the water isnt there a fine coming your way from the EPA? gas, Oil, Etc? Is the value of the Quad more then the fine? Im not sure, but the theory has merit. I guess I was looking for concrete evidence to either support this or not.

[1mainiac]

Saying you have no way to recover it does not apply as there are ways to get it back however the Coast Guard not being willing to remove your property does not make it fair game for anyone who wants it. Consider this you are out hunting and get hurt the DNR or Sheriffs patrol rescues you and takes you in for care is your Truck and hunting gear free for anyone to take and claim. since you are on Michigan property either way the same laws would apply.

[1mainiac]

By the way you are expressing it the next time someone has a heart attack on the ice and has to be taken in by ambulance all his gear would be fair game.

[Line Dancin]

If my memory serves me correctly , this was a guide slash charter comp. , and if so ,I think that if there is anyone in distress they are required to assist in a rescue.

Yeah i think you are right. it was an interesting episode.

[Priority1]

Skeeter, aka Nels is a member of this site. Last Spring Nels hit a partially submerged quad with his boat. The damage was substantial and he couldn't find the quad to get the ID#s from it. Boat damage is one thing but someone could have been killed or injured badly. I'll bet he wishes the pirates got that quad.

It seems there is more problems with people and their equipment being stranded on the ice than ever before. Some of these people have no common sense. With a strong offshore wind they will plank over cracks and go out any way. There are a lot of responsible ice fishermen and like always it's a handful of idiots that spoil it for everyone. If there is abandoned stuff left on the ice get it off as quickly as possible by any means. I don't venture out on the ice anymore because of physical limitations. I feel a lot better with a boat under my A$$.

Be careful on the ice and the water. Things can and will go wrong even under the best of conditions.

If you are fined for sunken equipment, you are still responsible to have it removed. It's not an either or.

[Josey_Wales]

Saying you have no way to recover it does not apply as there are ways to get it back however the Coast Guard not being willing to remove your property does not make it fair game for anyone who wants it. Consider this you are out hunting and get hurt the DNR or Sheriffs patrol rescues you and takes you in for care is your Truck and hunting gear free for anyone to take and claim. since you are on Michigan property either way the same laws would apply.

I think you are missing the point here. The people who get rescued are usually on ice flows going out to nowhere. I am not in any way shape or form defending what they do, but your hunting example does not really apply here. If I had a heart attack and was rescued.... my truck, stand, and equipment etc are not in danger of dangering the ecosystem. My example solely applied to the hard place they would be in with no easy way to get to their stuff. Its the whole reason they are being rescued. Granted this would be a RARE occurance, but I believe they are capitalizing on the fact that there are penalties for stuff falling into the water in god knows where. Where as my hunting stuff on dry land there is easy access, and no Major fines for your truck being parked there for an extended period of time. I also did not say it was "fair game" merely that these people are using their ability to recover this stuff in a adverse scenario to their advantage. That and the fact that id have to check the laws on possible fines for stuff falling in. Again not trying to argue for them or condone their behavior, basically trying to see if they exist or not.

[1mainiac]

I guess my point is that being rescued from the ice does not mean you have no way to return and recover your gear so yes if they take it without permission form the owner they are stealing it. Since there is no time stamp on what time the ice will melt and dump your gear in the water and many have found that they were on a section of ice that floated out only to have the wind change and blow them back in or elsewhere in the lake. Also one could point out that if your boat or ship sinks in the Great Lakes it is still yours hence the battle over some of the recently found shipwrecks. Again you could contact the fishermen and offer to go get their gear but to just go get it would be theft. And there are lots of places and situations you could have a heart attack where recovering your gear would be difficult. So some of my analogy is correct. However show me anywhere in State law that this is legal and I have some redneck friends down south that would be willing to bring their gear up and spend the winter collecting your favorite things.