New Tournament/ Need honest input

[wild at heart]

Today 7 individuals representing fisherman, tackle shops, charter fisherman/boats, and manufacturing/sponsers sat down and formed a committee to bring a new Salmon/Trout fishing tournament to West Michigan. Basicly it will be a copy of the LOC Derby on Lake Ontario tweaked to fit our circumstances. We have discussed the rules and will finialize them in the next couple weeks. We are asking for your input on several things that we are considering.

Basic premise of this tournament will be.

Boundries= Mich/Ind state line north to the pier at Whitehall.

Tournament Date= Memorial Day through Labor Day.

Biggest Salmon and Biggest Trout

Payout= Salmon, 10 to 20 places with first place $5000

Trout, 5 to 10 places with first place $2500

(based on 500 entries)

Cost= $30 per lincese Season, $10 3day, $5 youth.

Weigh Stations at 5 Ports. (St Joe, South Haven, Saugatuck, Port Sheldon, and Grand Haven)

Bi-weekly port prizes.

Lie detector for winners, and witnesses.

Every person on a boat will be required to have a license (excluding kids under age ???) for a fish to be a legal entry.

All DNR rules apply.

You can see the rest of the LOC rules on their website.

Nothing set in stone yet so feel free to comment on any of the above.

So what do you think ????????

We already have some sponsers, but would welcome others.

[2UNREEL]

Sounds awsome... I'll have to read more about it but I'm in!!!

[Nailer]

Kevin, the one thing I see wrong with your plan is: All the guys fishing the Muskegon area (Muskegon has a bunch!) need to come way back to Grand Haven. Port Sheldon and Grand Haven are close together, Do you need weigh in's at both?

It sounds like a great idea.

[wild at heart]

Nailer, we would welcome a weigh station in Muskegon if someone would step up with a certified scale and a desire to be involved.

[seabee]

Talk to Vinnie at Capt GARYS I am surehe would be delighted to help us folks out in Muskegon.

[RONDAYVOO]

I agree with everone else, A lot of people fish out of muskegon and running to grand haven can be a haul. I would be in but im not sure if I want to run south for a weigh in.

Just my two cents

[Paulywood]

I agree with the idea of a weigh in in Muskegon. Unless I had a monster I wouldn't bother weighing a fish caught out of Muskegon or Whitehall as Grand Haven is an hour out of my way. I would weigh in out of Port Sheldon. I think that the lie detector is needed and if you don't have one prearranged you should. It's too bad that people would cheat on something like this, but you know they will. I wonder if you could have people sign up online? It would be time stamped and maybe they could pay with PayPal? Just because I drive over from the middle of the state and wouldn't be able to have a crew member sign up if they decided to ride along. What about weighing in after a night trip? I'm not sure how they work this for the other derby's. Sounds like a great idea though.

[jay d]

sounds good,but we fish out of manistee that time of the year.why not any of the northern ports?

[Nailer]

Cost= $30 per lincese Season, $10 3day, $5 youth.

Every person on a boat will be required to have a lincese (excluding kids under age ???) for a fish to be a legal entry.

Does this mean that every one on the boat has to pay the fee, or just have a Fishing license?

[wild at heart]

Here is some answers to your questions, but keep in mind that nothing has been finialized yet, and we are seeking you opinion so we can come up with the best set of rules. Also we are leaning heavily towards the LOC rules because of the great job they are doing and there experience.

We definatly want to include the port of Muskegon fisherman but we need a tackle shop or store that wants to be involved with weighing fish. If you know someone thats interested have them contact me.

The reason we stopped at Muskegon was we all live down here and the consensus is that Whitehall and north have bigger fish and that would be a real advantage. If this turns out to be sucsessful there has been talk of getting some northerner's involved an having a north and south division someday.

On-line lincense purchasing is being looked into in conjuction with the web site, and everyone on a boat will need a "derby" lincense for any fish to qualify. We have also discussed the possibilty of a way to "lincense" a boat for the season, but could not figure out a way that would work with Charters also coming into the equation.

Night fisherman would have to get to a weigh station the next morning.

Lie detectors are not a threat, some winners will be required to submit to them between the tournament close and before the awards ceremony. Unfortunate but nescessary.

[jay d]

scared of us northern boys a:grin:

[Paulywood]

Sounds like you guys have some good ideas and are well organized. Hopefully one of the Muskegon guys can help out with a weigh-in. I would definitely participate. I am assuming the license would be good for any port, correct?

[wild at heart]

yes, any port

[seabee]

Call vinnie at cpatain gary's and tell him Rob from seabes charters refered you 1-231-206-3508 he is within 10 miniutes from any launch in Muskegon well maybee 20 he is off of Whitehall rd. in North Muskegon.

Here is some answers to your questions, but keep in mind that nothing has been finialized yet, and we are seeking you opinion so we can come up with the best set of rules. Also we are leaning heavily towards the LOC rules because of the great job they are doing and there experience.

We definatly want to include the port of Muskegon fisherman but we need a tackle shop or store that wants to be involved with weighing fish. If you know someone thats interested have them contact me.

The reason we stopped at Muskegon was we all live down here and the consensus is that Whitehall and north have bigger fish and that would be a real advantage. If this turns out to be sucsessful there has been talk of getting some northerner's involved an having a north and south division someday.

On-line lincense purchasing is being looked into in conjuction with the web site, and everyone on a boat will need a "derby" lincense for any fish to qualify. We have also discussed the possibilty of a way to "lincense" a boat for the season, but could not figure out a way that would work with Charters also coming into the equation.

Night fisherman would have to get to a weigh station the next morning.

Lie detectors are not a threat, some winners will be required to submit to them between the tournament close and before the awards ceremony. Unfortunate but nescessary.

[jimbobber]

Kevin , I like the idea of a boat sign up as i take lots of folks fishing and very seldom fish with the same crew. jimmy

[jimbobber]

Maybe a min of 4 person sign up for a boat ,or $120.00 per boat for the season?

[DIRTY DOG]

Sounds good to me. When would this start.

[Priority1]

A Tournament or Derby that is spread out like this can be a PITA for those running it, and also the participants. It's too wide open. JMHO:)

[wild at heart]

Where do you see the problems Frank?

If you want to fish in it you pick up a ticket at your nearest port, bring your big ones back to get weighed, and watch the web site for overall and port prizes.

The tackle shops do must of the work each covering their area, and they get more traffic thru the door for their effort.

What are we missing?

[1mainiac]

Some issues would be the Lie Detector is not even admissable in court some people can tell the truth and fail others lie from start to finish and pass. You could have a 4 person boat and 2 fail and 2 pass now other than the loss of money on the tests what do you do? For the most part the biggest fish will be caught in the last 30 days or less so it would be better to narrow the window down a bit. Also a 30 lb fish will lose several pounds sitting in a cooler overnight but I still like everything except the everyone in the boat requirement I would hate to have to throw someone overboard so they would not be on board when the big fish was caught LOL. I would do it but I sure would feel bad LOL

[Priority1]

Where do you see the problems Frank?

If you want to fish in it you pick up a ticket at your nearest port, bring your big ones back to get weighed, and watch the web site for overall and port prizes.

The tackle shops do must of the work each covering their area, and they get more traffic thru the door for their effort.

What are we missing?

You asked for honest opinions and that is what I gave. As far as details, how about cheating for one. I have seen it first hand. I enjoy the sport but will not compete when it's best cheater wins. I'm NOT saying it's going to happen, but there is nothing to stop it, Way too Loose. I didn't want to ruffle feathers, but honest opinions were asked for. Again JMHO. Peace Bro. GL to all.

[HitMan]

This has been attempted a numerous amount of times. Around 6-8 years ago Steve's Shiner Shack and the Grand Haven Steelheaders started the OATS tournament, which had the same concept, but was only for Ottawa County. This lasted 2 years, if I remember correctly, mainly because of lack of interest and the huge hassle of trying to get a fished weighed in. The other issue was everyone on board the boat had to have the license. If you don't go with the "boat registration," it will not work out, as you had hoped. Also, the OATS ran it's course because 2 charter boats won both years and the normal, weeknight, or weekend fisherman said the odds of them winning was very poor when charter boats are entered in the same division, can fish everyday, catch way more fish, etc. Yes, we did win the 1st year and got 2nd place the second year.

Therefore, my main points are:

1) Must be a BOAT registration only. Otherwise, too many guys fish with different guys each trip and day.

2) All bait shops must have the same weigh-in hours (very, very important for everyone to have an equal chance of weighing-in fish and also may determine the port where more guys are likely to fish, if the local bait shop is open later to weigh-in their fish)

Otherwise, back in the 80s, these were very popular and evident up and down the Lake Michigan shoreline.

[wild at heart]

Thanks for your input Jon. I hadn't thought about the weigh in times. Don't know how that will go over with the tackle shops.

I disagree with the registering of boats though for the very reasons you state. Your right that Charters like you have a big advantage. Skill, experience, and time on the water give you the edge. Thats why having you pay a boat fee of say $450 that would cover 450 people through out the season tips the hat even more in a charters favor. Now if all 450 pay the full amount that makes it more "fair", even though you still have a considerable advantage skill wise. And a contest like this will cover the whole range of skill levels, but anyone could hook in to that big one and win.

The essence of this tournament is that it is an individual contest not a boat contest. LOC runs this way and last year they paid out about $80000 in cash.

So that alone makes me think it can work. And I've been told that we have 3 to 4 times more potential fisherman to draw from then they do there.

[Paulywood]

I agree with you Kevin. I think it needs to be an individual tournament. I don't like the idea of a whole boat registration, for the reasons you state. And my crew is different for almost every trip. That is why I think internet registration is a good idea. I am hopeful that it will work out for you. And to be honest, I don't think it will be bad for you if some people are skeptical and take a wait and see approach for the year. It might be better if it starts a little smaller and builds over time. Have you thought about doing a couple of different flights, so to speak? Maybe 2 seperate 6 week tourneys? Once again, I wish you luck and thank you for doing it. Anything that promotes the sport is a good thing.

[Fishwhisperer]

It would seem that a great deal of the policing would fall upon those that weigh the fish in (bait shops). Will they be subjected to the lie detector test too?

I am in favor of not having a boat registration. This would help build the pot and increase the chances of the "weekend warrior" winning.