Line Twist

[JoeMan]

Any tips on avoiding line twist on rigger rods when running spinner/flys? I usually set the lure from 30' ot 50' behind the ball. I have no problems running spoons or plugs on the rigger rods. All lures have been productive for me on the riggers, its a pain keeping the twist from causing a mess in the line if someone allows some slack in the line. I run 20# mono on my rigger rods and I make sure the big ball bearing swivel is free on the front of the spinners. Thanks.

[bluedevil]

Are you tying your main line right to the big swivel on the flasher?

I tie a regular swivel to my main line and attach that to the big swivel on the flasher and that seems to be the fix that works for me.

[tangled mess]

try when you let the spinnie down let it down and stop and let it catch up and go under water and the keep tension on it on the way down

[SkeinMachine]

You can also try adding a bead chain swivel infront of the flasher,performs very well.

[1mainiac]

Have to agree with Bluedevil many of us use too big of swivels and snaps any swivelrated more than double your line test is over kill. I used to use 150lb test gear thinking bigger is better however it can kill the action I use 5D sampo doulock swivels rated for 50lbs and X3C Sampo's with the coast lock rated at 60 lbs. The 2/0 Rosco swivels on most flashers are rated at 225 lbs and were chosen for the snap size not the swivel I put my own swivel before every flasher and install bead chain and a duo lock on most of my flies. Never had a line twist since changing years ago.

[JoeMan]

I use a #5 Rosco SS swivel on the main line and I attach to the large BB swivel, still get the twist. I like the idea of the bead chain. Does the length behind the ball have an impact? Shorter length may allow the swivel to work better?

[1mainiac]

A number 5 Rosco is a 90 lb test stainless swivel but not ball bearing. Shorter length will apply more pressure to the swivel and reduce the size of the action so it would reduce line twist as well. Try a set of Sampos they are worth every penny.

[GLF]

Does the length behind the ball have an impact? Shorter length may allow the swivel to work better?

The further behind the ball you have it, the bigger the loop, and less rotations it will make. You have to watch how far behind the ball you run them, if you have flashers on two riggers next to each other. It is possible for them to tangle.

I have problems with the last 10 - 20' of the wire line curling up on my wire divers. I am going to try the bead chains on them.

[Paulywood]

I never run my flashers that far behind the ball. Usually 10-20 ft. back. Sometimes as close as 5 ft. back.

[Priority1]

I think the key is having a quality ball bearing swivel ahead of the flasher. The one on the flasher along with the one on your line gives it twice the twist protection. The bead chain suggestion is also an option. Presently I have all my walleye trolling set ups terminated with 25# bead chain swivels.

[justenough]

I put a good quality barrel swivel, then 24" behind that a good quality ball bearing swivel then connect to the flasher. I run this set up on all rigger, copper and lead core rods and get no line twist.

[1mainiac]

I agree Frank I never saw any sense in tieing 50 bucks in gear to a 10 cent swivel. I was fishing with a friend a couple years ago and he lost a diver setup cause the cheap swivel failed he cussed and reeled it in and started to retie with another cheap swivel. I had my small gear bag with me and made him put on a Sampo coast lock. I also changed out all of his swivels before we were done for the day and gave him a few spares. I also use the bead chain on a lot of setups it works great. I tend to be pretty anal about some things I just won't skimp on tackle so I buy the best I can get I take brand new fly rigs apart and retie them with Gamma Fluoro and Owner hooks. I build much of my own meat rigs and flies I tie my own crawler harness and make nearly all of my own leaders including wire leaders. Most of the lures out there were built by guys like me they were built with top of the line componets and field tested unfortunatly they often go into production with cheaper componets and sometimes get made high end for pro shops and such and low end for chain stores. Discount stores will often accept blems and seconds every manufacture has them and is glad to part with them. My dad worked at Wolverine Shoe for 13 years before he took a job at GM I watched him buy a pair of boots at Pay Less one time and it was funny he had the salesman nearly in tears. He pointed out the defects in every pair of boots they had untill he finally matched up a set with no defects.

[bluedevil]

I agree Frank I never saw any sense in tieing 50 bucks in gear to a 10 cent swivel.

Yea I learned that one the hard way myself.

When I first got into salmon fishing I spent mega bucks on gear and tackle and then bought cheap swivel's and line at first, that only lasted the first year..

I never run my flashers that far behind the ball. Usually 10-20 ft. back. Sometimes as close as 5 ft. back.

Nick,

Do you ever have problems with them tangling up with nearby riggers?

I used to have this happen all the time so I quit running flashers of the riggers and then I had a buddy tell me he was running his 100' behind the ball so I tried that and it is most times my top producer. This is running the large white hoochie and red meat rigg. Most times this is my top producer and seems to hook up on bigger fish.

[Paulywood]

Matt,

If you keep the leads short then they won't tangle. The longer the leads, the bigger the circles they make. Also, the big paddles make bigger circles. I usually run Spin Doctors. I have run Spinnies on 20' leads with an SWR next to it on a boat w/ a 7'10" beam and had no tangles.

Off Topic:

My uncle is up at Higgins and he said there are shanty's on the drop off on the north end. Are you up for a smelt fishing trip this year?

[Priority1]

Tangles with adjacent riggers can be reduced by running them at different depths. It's also wise when setting riggers to set the deepest ones first. I usually run my rigger depths in a V pattern with my deepest being the inside riggers. My out and downs are a little higher. I don't always run 4 riggers, but when the rigger bite is HOT all four will be down with sliders on everything except the flasher rigs. Off course weather and lake conditions dictate how much gear you want to put out.

[1mainiac]

I agree Frank they only time I differ from that pattern is when running SWR setups and long leads I run a SWR on my starboard outside rigger with the probe and hunt for the bottom of my temp range usually around 44 deg with 2 colors and a small spoon. I will run a long lead at least 80 to 100ft back on my other outside rigger about 5 ft above it and run shorter leads off the rear riggers above them then maybe 10ft behind the ball with a flasher fly setup and and 20to 30 ft back with a large spoon. I have better luck and less tangles with long leads off my outside riggers as they start out further apart. This is my favorite mid day setup then add in the divers with flasher flies and send out the core program.

[JoeMan]

I am going to check out the Sampo swivels. It soundslooks like the Sampo Coastlocks have the best snap configuration. Also I like JustEnough's technique to tie a barrel swivel just up the line and put a good snap/swivel to attach to the lure. Going to change my rigger and core lines to this setup. Thanks. I only have two riggers so I have never had the trouble with rigger lines tangling. My trouble with tangles, while not often, has been my high divers catching my inside core lines. Usually don't lose equipment but makes quite a mess.

[1mainiac]

Andy if your not getting tangles you ain't running enough setups LOL. Should have went out with me a few times in my Starcraft running 12 or more lines.

[JoeMan]

Jim, I'm usually running 10 rods; 2 riggers, 4 divers, 4 cores. I'll need a couple more rod holders to run additional rods. Love them cores!! I'll take you up on the trip if we can hook up this summer. Maybe we can swap trips. I have a 21' searay.

[1mainiac]

might have to take you up on that Andy Starcraft is for sale have a 26ft Four Winns now. Lots more room to fish than the old 18ft Starcraft can run up to 14 lines now if I keep it straight and don't tangle anything up. Can't wait to hit the water again.